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Cracks Show in Civil Engineering Department

Mar 04 2010 15:40
Lawrence Weetman
The Department of Civil Engineering has decided not to allow its masters students to fill in MOLE, the teaching survey for masters students, despite 14 masters students failing last year.
Live! is worried that "diluting" the standards of Imperial's Civil Engineers could lead to more disasters like this... maybe... at least, we think that's the problem.

Imperial College's Department of Civil Engineering has caused quite a stir around college after refusing to allow its masters students fill in the autumn Master's Online Evaluation (MOLE), claiming that the survey wasn't good enough.

Concrete: The Civil Engineering building is full of it.

MOLE, a new survey launched in 2009, is designed to obtain feedback from students about individual course modules, lectures and lecturers in an effort to improve Imperial's standard of teaching.

Despite MOLE, and Imperial's other student online evaluaton surveys (SOLE, TOLE and ROLE), being rewritten by college's statisticians with statistical validity in mind, the Department of Civil Engineering has said that the survey is "statistically invalid" and insists that its own survey is better.

Dean of Students, Professor Susan Eisenbach, requested several weeks ago that the department submit the results of its own student survey to registry, to prove that it has complied with college's basic quality assurance procedures, however the department has failed to submit the necessary data and it is believed that they do not plan upon doing so in the future.

Gone: Adrian Butler

This lack of feedback comes after 14 masters students in the Civil Engineering department failed their course in the last academic year, missing out upon a degree from Imperial. The department only had 87 masters students during this time.

In the same year, around 30 of the department's first year students also failed the year before resits. This makes up around one-third of the entire year.

Over the summer, senior tutor Adrian Butler was replaced with Jamie Standing, however the department insists that this was not related to the high failure rates. An anonymous email to Live! in October said "the story is that the rector wasn't happy".

"Unacceptable" Results

Live! contacted Deputy President (Education), Jon Silver, who said that the failure rate was "totally unacceptable". When Live! quoted this to Professor Julian Bommer, Director of Undergraduate studies for the Department of Civil Engineering, he aggressively defended his department, asking whether Live! had contacted other students who would have had the value of their degrees lowered had the failed students been allowed to pass.

Acceptable: Julian Bommer

Professor Bommer informed Live! that the department did not have a comment to make, however he did talk about the "acceptability" of the results in an email to the Live! Editor, saying: "a debate on pass marks, failure rates and standards in education would be addressing very key and important issues. And my starting point is that what would be most unacceptable would be for Imperial to line itself up with the erosion of standards and dumbing down that has infected this country so strongly in recent years. We need to be comfortable with being - and remaining - an elite institution".

Imperial College currently has set departments of targets for departments, suggesting that 70% of students should be awarded either a 2:1 or a 1st at the end of their degree. Imperial's departments are regularly criticised for handing out poor degrees, with last year's Deputy President (Education & Welfare) Hannah Theodorou suggesting in an interview with Live! that departments not meeting these targets either have a poor intake of students, poor quality of teaching or have set their standards too high.

The failures in Civil Engineering were mentioned at the Engineering Studies Committee in November 2009, with Professor Bommer blaming the high number of failings in the department was due to the pass-mark in exams being raised from 30% to 40%, rather than an increase in the difficulty of the course or a lower calibre of student. However Live! has not received reports of other departments experiencing the same surge in failings, despite the same conditions.

The college does have a 70% target for 2:1s and firsts and there are some that are consistently below that and that either means that we are taking in poorer-quality students than in all of the other departments or the teaching in that department isn't bringing them up to scratch.
Hannah Theodorou, Ex-Deputy President (Education and Welfare)

Bommer said that in a usual year around ten first year students would fail their initial exams, and that had the 40% pass-mark been implemented several years ago then higher numbers of students would have failed in those years too.

He went on to explain that of the 14 students that failed the fourth year of their course, around 12 were a group of friends who had been "coasting" along for the entirety of their degree, just scraping through.

The Director of Undergraduate Studies said that he hoped the increased pass-mark in earlier years would separate such individuals earlier in their time at Imperial, thus decreasing failure rates in later years.

Staff Feedback

As well as students not being able to fill in MOLE, the Department of Civil Engineering did not pass feedback from TOLE, Imperial's Tutorial Online Evaluation survey, to personal tutors.

Civ Eng think they're too special to allow their students to do the Autumn Term's MOLE.
Jon Silver, Deputy President (Education)

Imperial College Union's DPE, Jon Silver, said that "it's still a great shame that the [TOLE] feedback never got there", saying that along with the feedback from MOLE the survey gave tutors - all of whom were rated positively by students - "evidence" of their high standards of teaching.

The lack of this evidence for staff in the department would, Silver claimed, make it harder for staff to obtain promotions backed-up by their performance.

Live! contacted the Head of Department of Civil Engineering, Professor David Nethercot, however the department has so far declined this opportunity to comment. Live! does, however, understand that Professor Susan Eisenbach is currently negotiating for the department to participate in the Spring MOLE survey.

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Discussion about “Cracks Show in Civil Engineering Department”

The comments below are unmoderated submissions by Live! readers. The Editor accepts no liability for their content, nor for any offence caused by them. Any complaints should be directed to the Editor.
Mar 04 2010 16:39
 

Are you a Civil Engineer? Or just a disgruntled Imperial student? Are the department right to award fewer "good honours" degrees?

Add your comments below...

2. hmm   
Mar 04 2010 16:59
 

He's right, we should be comfortable in being elite.

However, there shouldn't be so many failures, because they shouldn't have accepted those weak students in the first place. It's a very poor strategy of the Dept. to let in people without the ability to succeed. That they let the group of 12 'coast' to final year only to fail them is unacceptable and immoral. If you're going to claim 'elitism' then at least follow through and kick out people not up to scratch. It would be interesting to see the 'Fee Status' of those students - Internationals I'll bet. What does the Admissions Tutor have to say about this?

It also seems that they raised the bar to 40% after admitting the students into final year.

There'll always be people who can't hack it but to have such a high proportion of a year fail shows it's clearly the Department at fault here. No wonder they don't want College to see the feedback...

Mar 05 2010 04:47
 

To fail students in their final year is a touch harsh but I doubt it was for financial reasons. Most of fated fourteen weren't international students.

They did doss about alot and coasting the border of pass and fail is a dangerous game. None of them had to, they were all extremely intelligent that's why they had lasted so long with no work. They definetly could hack it, in fact sometimes it's the people with better grades who look tired and down because of trying to achieve your self-percieved standards. These guys knew exactly what game they were playing. It just so happened that Civ Eng also played the game and so were reforming policy on repeating exam questions, and mixing it up a little, and they got caught in the difference. They took the risk and lost, c'est la vie.

I was in this year by the way. I wasn't one of the fated fourteen though.

I am impressed that the department has grown some balls and decided to say NO to the college. I was always frustrated with the rigidity and conformity of the dept. and coll.

The college is the one putting pressure on departments for cutting funding, increasing international numbers to gain money, closing dep. libraries(another Civ Eng Thorn in the college's side), creating generic cafes with monopoly power (re: claud's cafe), removing expensive traditions (threat of leaving the albert hall for grad. day/the college crest), etc.

A balance must be struck with being a financially viable institution, quality and equality for students and academic excellence. This is done by representation of the three goals by the college admin, the student body and the departments. Unfortunately there are few activists and too many see out conformists within the student body, and the departments are made up of the same damp squibs.

But seemingly the Civ Eng Dept has had enough and is taking the fight to the college. I salute this, C'est La Guerre.

And if the students don't like the MOLE thing, I would suggest that they should also get off their a**es and fight and restrike the balance of power. Vive la Revolution.

Mar 06 2010 13:20
 

The tuition in the department is appalling. All the lecturers care about is their own research. If they even bother to turn up for tutorial sessions, they just read or hand out some notes then leave a bunch of phd students to deal with any queries. Their notes on the whole are useless, and there was little attempt by the department to integrate into the whole university by introducing alternative modules (management etc) which would have been very useful to prospective civil engineers.

5. aaa   
Mar 25 2010 00:42
 

At least some good news from this place... I have studied in a number of unis around the world and I have never seen so mush boasting about so much c**p as here in IMperial... 70% of their undergrads don?t come even closer to the worst 70% I have ever met.. the reputation of IC degrees , in all honesty, is in great decline... if this is the best UK education has to offer, no wonder why in the US they dismiss us so much.. but at least somebody is beaing scincere.. bravo CEng... hopefully withing some decades the CEngDep will re-gain what has been lost in the just few past years!!!

Sep 03 2011 12:11
 

The question is very complex when foregin students are involved. In continental European countries secondary education is very much broader. For instance, in Belgium 8 subjects are studied in the final year of secondary education (in the UK just 3). My daughter who was educated in Belgium scored in excess of 90% in her leaving certificate exams and speaks 3 languages. However, she has struggled at Imperial because the level of her education in Maths and Physics was below that of A Level. So, doing badly has more to do with background than ability. The annoying thing is that Imperial should have known this before accepting her.

Dec 02 2011 14:18
 

High prestige + easy to pass MSc courses is clearly indecent. So the efforts to keep the REAL high value of MSc degrees from Imperial is commendable. The idea of dictating a minimum number of a given class to classify a course as "acceptable" is appaling. Quality content and fairness of courses are checked by external examiners, so once this has been checked, failure numbers must be respected without victimising the staff in charge of the course.

People who are resisting the erosion of academic standards are really saving the good name of UK universities. They should be given support not attacks. Why is it that nobody cares about the students who passed their exams and do well in courses? Was it that they all are genious? Was it that they really took the course seriously and behaved as responsible adults? Why is it that none asks the following question to good students: What is your secret ? why did you do well while other students failed the course? Did you require divine inspiration to succeed in the course or was it hard work? What was it more important for you: A: to pay attention during lectures or B:to be plugged to your mobile during lectures?

QUALITY IS FAR MORE IMPORTANT THAN NUMBER OF FAILURES

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