The time is nigh when Davy shall return to its rightful owners, but not through ransom or any demands by The City or any of its horses. Good day to you.

Was this the controversial article you promised me?

The Wooden Horse is back! Well done lads... you've made an old engineer smile.

this is excrement

ps chris wrote that

I don't think I've ever see Davy look so good... the Guilds scarf suits him!

With my Spanner hat on I can't say anything short of very well done.

It's a shame that the Davy can't wear a Guilds jacket.... I wonder where they might be?

What, you mean the INVIOLATE jackets that aren't even mascots?

How on earth did you carry that around? Davy is looking awfully shiny and pretty, sightseeing must b good for him, shame he's not with his rightful owners though.

Davy IS looking very shiny. We felt we had to clean him after we lowered him into the Thames. Mind you, you'll have lots of cleaning to do when you dig him up!

whats the difference between minesman and guildsman?

Guildsman are c**ts!

where has the picture of davy the urinal gone?

A little birdie told me that the RCS's anonymous benefactor was none other than jon matthews

I doubt it, he actually likes mascotry. Why would he pay money to get theta back, only for RSC to declare it invoilate and not provide another violet one?

I heard that Guilds funded it themselves just to clear the sorry situation up.

I heard that RCS managed to steal it back and Guilds fed Live! lies as a cover up!

Live! has seen both the cheque and the bulb of Theta at the same time - they certainly did not steal the bulb bit back. As for the upright bit, we haven't seen that.

Has there ever been a violet theta? What would you make one out of? Good idea.

There should be several different coloured ones that are interchangeable. That would be pretty. And just for extra fun the violate mascot should be based on the colour scheme so only a certain part in a certain colour is violate at a given time.

I am currently using the upright part of Theta as a pleasuring device. I want to work may way up to the bulb... and hopefully by the end of term I will be able to fit Davy in. Wooooo Davy the dildo. Uhhhhhh Davy yeah!

Let?s be fair here, we all know why guilds let go of theta. Simply, Tristan insane plan to ?bring back mascotry? did not work. Whilst guild appears to be having a good time with mascots both the RSM and the RSC got on with actually doing something for students (yes, the people that these unions represent). Guild?s spent a ridiculous amount of time doing nothing but at least now we know where all the time went, don?t we Milli/Tris.

except for some s**ty "ball" which took place in the MDH ffs... what has RSM done all year? same goes for RCS?

I think you will find. That. Tristan is a s**t president and yes guilds haven't s**t this term but.

Mascotry has been totaly misinterpreted by all. Its supposed to be a few people who want to be silly in raising money for charity but becuase of the a**e up way in which Tristan has dealt with everythign and the poor poor outlook from rsm it hasn't gone swimingly. If it was Jon Matthews who paid for theta to be returned then I want to congratulate him, for he clearly cares about his own institution as well as RAG. The rest of you need to take a leaf out of his book!

Thats all I have to say about that.

Apart from the freshers' ball, we've had many sucessful barnights, with good attendance across the board from first years to postgrads,

we had a sucessful Christmas Ball, in the Kensington Close Hotel with 100 plus attending.

The RSMA hosted a large number of current students at their christmas dinner and we are looking for opportunities to organise more joint event this summer.

We've had fornightly edition of the pit, which has recieved many contributions from its members.

Regalia is doing better than ever with ?1000s of turnover, this year has seen the reappearence of RSM cufflinks, tie-pins and girl-fit polos.

And since we are a CSC its only fair to sing the praises of our clubs:

RSM hockey is going from strength to strength competing in two leagues and attracting many new members.

RSM football have lost 9 out of their 10 matches, but its the taking part that counts... better luck for the rest of term!

DLB is suffering slightly from the shorter easter term, but has organised a sellout tour of Isle of White, the first taste of fieldwork for the freshers... who got a valuable preview of the stratigraphy they will encounter on their field course at the end of this term.

RSM rugby and golf are probably doing something too.

DLB have also filled the larger RSM lecture theatres with inspiring talks from current Postgrads, with 3D glasses and absolutely breath taking views accross the world's most impressive mountain belts. And the Gooma loomas have been very popular.

Upcoming events include the DLB synposium, more fieldtrips, more talks.

The RSM are looking forward to the Bottle match and associated barhights- highlight of the year, the RSM Rag Curry night and looking to the summer term we'll see the return of the RSM sports day and final finale.

I've probably forgotten lots of important stuff, but we are a functioning part of the Union and our officers have put a lot of time and effort in to organising events, as with all officers, in all parts of the Union.

I congratulate RSM on the amount they have done and have pointed out that RSM are an extremely important feature of the union. The truth is Bollo mascotry is not the only thing faculty unions do. They are meant to look after students! We could all see from the beginning that C&G were far too obsessed with rearranging their office (for efficiency) and with theta and davy. The problem was whilst the other faculty unions got on with the day-to-day work; C&G metaphorically speaking sat smugly in a corner muttering under their breath about raising money for RAG whilst the other unions publically declared that they would find positive ways to raise money. In fact, committee members of said unions claimed that this method would be more effective and more importantly it would raise awareness of RAG (Note: the RAG president seemed to be concerned about this). How many people does mascotry involve outside the C&G inner circle? At the end of the day the RCS and RSM acknowledged that their students really didn?t mind about mascotry but found way to involve them in making money for charity. C&G did not!

Besides Bollo you talk about these organisations as if they were entities in themselves. Let make this clear, the RCSU and RSMU are nothing without the students that they represent. C&G must realise this and move on from the 1960!

It is with great sadness that having left Imperial College many years ago I return to see that C&G continue to slate the RSM, despite their comparatively remarkable efforts to organise events. And the success and high turnout of these events is a testimony to the efforts of the committee.

My message is simple; C&G, give the Davy back to RSM immediately and stop this ridiculous attempt to draw attention on yourselves and look good in light of your disasterous recent years. RSM will live on because of the Geologist's spirit, C&G will not. It's that simple.

I'm afraid I have to agree with the RSM concensus on here. I feel that Guilds has not spent enough effort on looking after their students. The event list that RSMer has stated has put Guilds to shame. Less stealing stuff, more working for students please!

I don't think it's fair to make a link between running a c**p Union and being active in mascotry. It's just a shame that the people who have been interested in bringing mascotry back have also been a bit lax with doing stuff for all student to get involved in.

It is possible that a Union can do both things, it just needs the right people to get involved at the same time. Mascotry should continue, I think there has to be a meeting between Unions with the Presidents representing the mascot clubs (Wooden Horse etc.) and deciding to play by the rules and make it fun again.

With respect RCS alumnus it has been clearly stated by the principle officers of the RCS (at the recent council meetings where the topic of mascotry has been briefly discussed) that C&G were told before the thefts that the RCS did not to get involved in mascotry. Perhaps because they felt it was not essential to the RCS. Whilst RSM did acknowledge that mascotry could raise money as far as I understand one of their main concerns was the serious breach of college rules that occurred (that apparently resulted in serious talks between college and faculty unions excluding C&G) and that it seem particularly unsporting (theft of two inviolate mascots, theta and big davy).

Thus in a single move Tristan (C&G president) manage to kill mascotry by breaking the rules and then having the gall to claim that he (and the VPA ? Milli) set mascotry policy. In other words, Tristan felt he out ranked the committees of both the RCS and RSM (completely incorrect). The anonymous donor retrieved Theta at least one part in order to give C&G a break and allow them to save face.

It is possible to do both things but the rules that faculty unions have had for years should have been respected. Now it may not be possible to go back...

Tristan doesn't seem to come out very well in all of this, refusing to return the Inviolate Davy isn't playing by the rules... but is almost excusable.

Making invalid ransom demands (you are suppose to steal the whole thing) and then when a ransom is agreed and paid, refusing to return part of the mascot is completely out of order.

He has no understanding of Mascotry and its rules. Rumour has it apparently he won't even tell Guilds where the missing part of theta is...

I heard the only reason why guilds haven't no-confidenced him is because they think that a s**t president is better than no president, but I disagree.

A s**t President is better than going through the long bureaucratic process of outing him - time better spent on trying to sustain Guilds.

I do believe that Tristan has made himself controversial. The problem however is endemic in the guilds office. The front page of Guildsheet at the start of this year had ?the rise of guilds? written on the front page. If you have read the main stories was about the C&G bar night and pertinently the Mascotry that had occurred over the summer. That in itself suggests that the mentality of CGCU is that it must destroy/crush the other faculty union whereas it may have been more effective to work with them. Look at the comment Tristan is rumoured to have made about RSM despite the fact that he should be representing them. If you still don?t believe me read some of the comments on this page, I just hope they aren?t really from Milli or Tristan. Simply, guildsmen think that damaging the other faculty unions is part of their role.

Tristan decided to steal Inviolate Theta and Inviolate Davy. Tristan was told that he had stolen inviolate mascots. Tristan decided not to give them back. However at any point members of the C&G committee could have stopped him. They chose not to because they saw this as a way of returning to their ?former glory?. Now they must clear up his mess. Remember Guilds was a dominate force in faculty union politics because of the lack of an RCSU. The only way forward for guilds is to accept the RCSU and RSMU and work with them.

Tristan is controversial because he believes that he alone was powerful enough to re-write all the rules. Not only between the unions, college rules and to top it off he once had a stab at trying to surpass council via proxy (remember he and VPA set mascotry policy).

"Simply, guildsmen think that damaging the other faculty unions is part of their role"

I'm quite offended by a lot of the comments on here, especially that one, because:

• I've seen the hard work people have put in over the last week to get Guilds back on its feet
• I gave some help (only a little, but still not trying to destroy it) to the RCS last year

The fact is, Guilds underperformance this year has nothing to do with mascotry. Vast amount of effort has not been expended trying to get mascotry running, its just that no effort has really been spent anywhere else either.

Tristan's attitude and "management (dictatorship) style" has generated friction and the office was almost always closed. Lax budgetting, not accepting advice from others (e.g. his committee, the DPFS) have led to financial disasters and failed events. Over the past two weeks (while Tristan has been off ill), the rest of the committee and others involved in various ways have started to pull together - the office has been open almost all day for most of the last week, with between 5 and 10 people in there at any time. The finances are being examined closely with the aim to turn them around. Events are being planned and sponsorship raised.

If every person who was in the office can put just a little bit of work in, Guilds can be turned around and be in good shape for next year. At the same time, there are a small group who would like to engage in mascotry for the fun of it, without it affecting the activities of the union.

The constant sniping, particularly by the RSM, won't help that - perhaps its time to start working together while you have a group willing to put the work in. Why don't you slip a list of your dep-reps, dep-soc chairs and anyone else who might be helpful under the door in the office?. You can always contact the new Hon Sec, Ed Judge, with the same list and I guarantee he'll act on it. Alternatively, its easy to figure out who I am, send me a list and I'll make sure someone does something about it.

I'm not sure what people have suddenly got against Milli either - apart from the fact that she sometimes comes across as a bit rude when she's not really trying to be.

And you should also remember the Guilds depsocs: CivSoc on its own manages to run a similar size of event to the RSM, with Aero, EEE and ChemEng also running large events. While this doesn't excuse Guilds for not doing anything, it makes it far less disastrous than if all the DepSocs were dysfunctional. They are far from it and I'd rate CivSoc among the best at Imperial.

Please stop the bickering and start co-operating while there's a team there willing to do it.

Can we please start by dissasociating Mascotry and the poor running of Guilds this year.

Firstly the Guilds poor efforts since November onwards are down soley to Tristan and his "illness" and poor attitude.

Yes Tristan has been involved in Mascotry... I personally don't think he should be involved at all and seen as he has not showed up at college for the last 2 months... he hasn't had anything to do with the return of Theta or the ongoing c**p with Theta. The running of Guilds has nothign to do with the other members of the trojan horse.

I would like to also point out that 90% of the c**p that "hang on" came out with is totaly and utterly untrue. Malicous lies to make Guilds look bad. I think this is pathetic and not helping.

Firstly, THETA IS NOT INVIOLATE!!!!! The comments about issuing incorrect ransoms as to not having all of it were rumours put about by Jon Matthews. There are many rules and most of them are not written down. When this was proposed, we asked an old ex guilds memebr who still works at Imperail and knows anything and everything said...."TELL EM BOLLOCKS" He also states that the Brass shiny Davy is the Violate one... as does the contract Danny signed which guilds have. (RSM will now say that the president doesn't have the power to declare wha tis a nd what isn't violate.... don't care... we have a written contract).

There has been lots of c**p to hide which DAVY lamp is violate... which is why we took both.... and then were "tricked" into giving the wrong one back... or were we? who the hell knows anymore? RSM should just grow up and pay the ?300 ransom to RAG... and while they're at it... they should declare once and for all, in writing, which Davy lamp is inviolate. The shiny brass coloured one, if it isn't anymore, was definately the violate one at onepoint. And if it was switched around then the document declaring this shoudl be public. (if you take off the handle on the top you can see that RCS have stolen it in the early 90's "RCS 89-90" and "RCS 87" with various intials also. So it seems we are not the only ones who carry on this fine and more importantly fun tradtion.

CGCU will be working with RSM in the coming term to raise money for RAG... we hope everyone else will join in in good spirit and welcome the united front of fun!

Ok, so I was a little mean and yes I know who you are In The Know we do know each other. However, to clarify the both RSM and the RCS offered to help C&G, and some joint event have occurred. However, I disagree with your assessment, the generally direction was set early on this year when Tristan decided to steal mascots. Given the extensive ties between unions at that point it was known that any course of action like that was likely to frustrate the other faculty unions. In particular questions were also raised about whether ?high ranking? members of the union (I.E the C&G president) should be breaking college rules so flagrantly. You know as well as I do that this was done in order to bring guild back to their ?former glory?.

The work done by the guilds committee isn?t under fire. The question is when dubious acts occurred why did they not register their objections? Why didn?t they fight for the people they represent?

At no point have I criticised you depsocs so that is not relevant. However, Tristan generally attitude toward RSM was quite frankly worrying form the first week of term and even before them.

Now so that you are inform THETA was INVIOLATE. Members of the RCS who were there at the time (before summer) will tell you so. Any mascot can be made inviolate, however it could have been publicised better and fair on with the RCS they made it clear that it had not be publicised well enough what with Felix going under. You do not have to keep an inviolate mascot that is a myth any faculty union can pull out of the mascotry game by making all their mascots inviolate. One last thing you do need all the parts that is why Theta was made that way. The idea that the RSM president could sign away an asset that valuable is frankly ridiculous just face it wooden horse? you got done. Nice one Danny

I've said it before, but i'd just like to point out, while I agree with some of the stuff hang on writes... I am not hang on... just in case you really don't know who it is :)

I Apologise for the spelling mistakes was in a rush.

The main spelling thing being :

Now, so that you are informed THETA was INVIOLATE.

Sorry

I am not in the know... you have got that one wrong. Theta is violate and is currently in the process of being made inviolate. You are totally wrong on this point, please provide evidence to the contrary. You people who have been posting these messages clearly haven't a clue what is going on or you would know the current situation which you don't... it is all speculation and misinformed lies.

Tristan has been unorthodox in his methods... Tristan hasn't broken any rules.

Hang on: You either haven't read what I wrote, or you've decided to just continue ranting/bickering rather than taking it on board. Regardless of how the "tone was set" at the start of the year by Tristan, there is a team in place willing to co-operate. Previous joint events seem to have been organised via Tristan, who didn't always (if ever) pass enough information on to the committee. PLEASE MAKE USE OF THE NEXT COUPLE OF WEEKS TO REBUILD THE RELATIONSHIP.

On the subject of mascotry, it should be nothing to do with the committees of the faculty unions: it shouldn't impact on the performance of the unions either! Your problem is conflating the two.

BTW: you must inform the RAG chair when a mascot is made inviolate/violate.

I am disappointed with the amount of bickering that seems to of occurred over this age-old tradition of fun and charity. In my time at Imperial both ?Big Davy? as well as Spanner and Bolt were ransomed and even though this annoyed their respective unions, the ransoms was duly paid. I am deeply worried that the sense of good will and giving has been lost from mascotry.

Guilds, RSM and RCS in unison: "they started it"

1. Separate mascotry from Guilds being s**t
2. RSM + C&G (+RCS) to work together (can be done with the current C&G team)
3. Let people who care about mascotry worry about it (mascots were NOT created to sit on a shelf/only appear at events)
4. Happiness and co-operation!

in response to post 44 .

Your comment makes no sense? It is clear Guilds started it... and being one of the 4 who stole Davy, I would know this, yes?

I think you have missed the point of every single persons posts on this discussion board!

I think you have missed the point of post 43. Guilds started taking mascots - who started the bickering?

The bickering is pathetic and gets in the way of resolving the real issue, as people on here keep coming back to it. It's the wrong problem. The mascots are safe and judging by this article being looked after/taken out. Guilds could hold on to them for another year and it wouldn't make the damnedest bit of difference - they'd just sit in a cupboard anyway, as no-one else wants to play.

The real issue is Guilds working with Mines and RCS. Guilds 6,000 members don't give a s**t about mascotry.

Not the point? = Most of the members don't care about guilds... so.... most don't know what it is.... and its the same for the RCS and RSM.... But some of you will care... and the institution does. I know of one RSM girl who cares a lot about the fact Davy hasn't been returned... she is trying to recover it herself by stealing it back, and good luck to her. I mean.. she'll be hard pressed to atm, as its in France, but when it returns she will continue i'm sure. I'm sure she'd be just as happy to have RSM pay for it to be returned. It will never simply be handed back because some tosser on live says he and his clan don't care

We will have to hold Davy for another year then it seems. Maybe you'll all forget about it.... and then i'll sell it once i've left imperial... and then 20 years later... someone will dig out the records and say... what happened to Davy... why didn't that tosser Danny not care enough about his own institution as to have a bar night in order to raise money for charity and retrieve what should be your pride and Joy.

I think the point of post 43 is that your own sodding clan hates you for the s**t attitude you have taken, and wants you to pay up so that his own mascot can be returned to his own institution.

The real issue IS Guilds working with mines and rcs.... but some people want to keep the good old traditons going... and if you don't care about that... then maybe you shouldn't be at imperial... or even be commenting on this article... or even ..... never mind....

Post 45 sums it all up very well indeed!

Perhaps I was a little hasty in my condemnation of guilds. I don?t mean to detract from guild?s work but I know that the mascotry situation did spoil relations between the faculty unions. In effect it was a slap in the face to other the unions this effective severed relations with other faculty unions. Thus I believe that it is Guild that needs to make the first move.

@ In the know

As for the RAG chair thing I find it hilarious that a Guildsman would talk about the rules whilst keeping an INVIOLATE mascot. It seems that you guys don?t care about the rules. Why would you start making them up now?

Secondly why should I take on board what you have said, you did not make a single point. But if you would like ill got through your arguments (comment #35)

(A)I feel that Guilds underperformance is a direct result of the mascotry situation and symptomatic of a deeper problem.

(B)I don?t care about Tristan?s management style

(C)I don?t know what guilds will do in the future + I don?t care

(D) Perhaps RSM should but frankly we all understand that particular relationship

(E) ? hate ?

(F)I have not said anything about your depsocs ? however let me point out member of your depsoc committee have expressed concerns in the past about the support (or lack thereof) form the guild exec ? however I think they are excellent

(G)This ?bickering? started when guild ran roughshod over the other faculties ? this is directly linked to mascotry and linked closely with guild performance

As for comment #41

Perhaps you should be taking the time to rebuild the relationship. You broke it. You fix it.

This is my point. Guild should aim to represent its members not an ?elite? group of the president?s mates. It members include people inside RSM. Thus you should go to RSM, apologise and sort the mess out quickly. If Tristan won?t do it you should.

C&G should put its members first and its pride second. Do you disagree?

Well well. Like I said before, a meeting needs to occur between the Unions, with representatives speaking on behlaf of the mascot teams. It's a shame that this year all the FU presidents have been tossers (whether they are involved in mascotry or not). Especially the 'President of RSM', what a c**t. It's his problem for not paying the ransom and generally having a s**t attitude (even towards RSM members, so I hear).

These are small problems that can be overcome by discussion and communication between Unions.

This is a turning point. Will mascotry fall by the wayside, blunder on in mediocrity or rejuvenate and become a solid tradition that provides fun for those involved AND raise money for charity.

People in power, please heed these words.

re: post 48 from 'what?'. If Davy really is in France then you're breaking a major rule of mascotry - that the mascots all have to stay on campus!

How the f**k do you expect to get any kind of game going if you make it impossible for your opponents to compete? (this is not just a rant at you, but that attitude of C&G mascoteers in general, since 2005 at least).

Also the tosser that put the pictures of Davy on Facebook, for f**ks sake mascotry is supposed to be anonymous. You're just asking for a kidnapping/hit squadding.

@Hang on - I'm not involved in mascotry so I'm not holding an inviolate anything. But yet again, you come to the same point. You're more interested in bitching about something which is mostly irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Perhaps its the attitude of the RSM which prevents Guilds and RSM working together after all?

Wow, seeing as at least two Presidents are currently working towards organising a Four Unions Barnight, I don't understand why people think that there is this big conspiracy of "not working together".

A general statement to Guilds, I have not at any point slated your depsocs, I was purely responding to bollo's qustion of "what have RSM done?"

As for mascots, fine either get involved or not, RSM haven't paid... big deal, we need it for the bottle match, so we will. RCS were lucky though, somebody paid for them, solving the "it's actually against the law to pay a RAG ransom from SGI/Grant" problem.

I BROKE GUILDS - I SNITCHED ON THEM - I GAVE BACK DAVY

I bloody well did not. I double crossed them but unfortunetely they were persistant. Davy is back with rsm. I'm sorry, i very very bad.

Well... Davy is back at home with the RSM now... unfortunatly RAG does not get the ?300 it so badly badly needed Sally!

The CGCU are of course dismayed that they lost Davy due to overwhelming force, but are glad to see that 15 RSMers cared enough to be wait half an hour outside the office on a Sunday morning in order to retrieve him.

Sally who was only trying to double cross them, recieved a broken finger in the process and so we feel is suitably punished. She has also been kicked out of Guilds to wander the lonely corridors of the Imperial college without anyone to take her in... maybe the RSM will lend a hand. Sorry Sally... no CGCA dinner for you this year!

giggles, but did they get spanner?

Ok, I take my sweary rant back. Well done RSM for finally getting involved!

THE DAVY RETURNS HOME>>>>>>>>>>>>>

SKINNER'S BOTTOM IS VICTORIOUS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Skinners Bottom 1

Wooden Horse 0

Let the games begin.

Is it not:

Skinners Bottom 1

Wooden Horse 1

Black Hole 0

At present? I'm fairly sure stealing your own mascot back makes it a draw.

given wooden horse got theta shouldn't it be...

Skinners Bottom 1

Wooden Horse 2

Black Hole 0

Well done everyone.... MASCOTRY IS BACK! and the RCS suck bottoms!

I'm glad to say in response to post 57...that Spanner remains in the CGCU office, as the fools did not look hard enough... next time you use overwhelming force... make the most of it haha

Brilliant,

Don't you just love how much every one is so passionate about all this. I really don't think any FU is gonig to go down in the near future if we have people like this.

Good luck every one.

The davy is back..

c&g still owe the RSM one glass cabinet after the breakage of the last one...

c&g still need to learn which the REAL mascot is.... idiots!

love love

(sucks to be you!)

Look, I offered to pay for the cabinet out of my own pocket the day I broke it. Leah decided not to charge me because:

1. It was broken to start with.

2. It was a fitted cabinet and the RSM were about to get a whole new office!

Well done, getting Davy back btw. Longstaff's got some explaining to do though!

This article came up in the Live! archive for today, and I thought it was really quite funny and had a great discussion... Well worth a read.